8.18.2005
Response to talk radio
Last toke: 22 days
Last smoke: 15 days
Beginning today, I am going to blog about things I hear on the local Christian afternoon talk show that I listen to on my drive home from work. Recently, several shows have touched on subjects that I feel are very important for Christians to discuss intelligently. Since that rarely happens on the show, for a variety of reasons, including constraints of the call-in format, host bias and woeful lack of biblical knowledge in the listening audience. I hope to take things to a deeper and more honest level.
WORD-FM has been using guest hosts on the afternoon talk show since they disingenuously dismissed Marty Minto in the wake of his on-air criticisms of Catholic dogma in the days of the death of Pope John Paul II. Predictably, these hosts have been serving up mostly theological softballs that are barely worth the time to consider, although the amount of biblical ignorance displayed by the callers continually amazes me.
The guest host for the first three days of this week is a United Methodist pastor by the name of Eric Park. The predominant topic of the Monday and Tuesday shows was: Why is the church in the West losing membership?
The subject was stirred up within Pastor Park as a result of an article he'd read concerning the decline of church participation in Western Europe. Of particular interest to him was the apparent distinction between 'spirituality' and 'religion' among interviewees in the article.
Understandably, Rev. Park confessed great interest in the issue, owing to being a pastor within a denomination that is undoubtedly affected by this phenomenon. During Tuesday's broadcast in particular, he kept harping on a caller whose belief was that people were leaving the Church because of a 'watering down' of the message of the Gospel, particularly in its response to the epidemic of divorce among professing Christians.
Putting aside for the moment the unbelievable amount of denial implied in that statement, I'd like to focus instead on what Rev. Park did with the subject of divorce in the Church.
While acknowledging that there is inevitably a choice to sin involved in any divorce situation, Rev. Park decided to use two passages from the Gospels to present his own views. In the first example, he discussed the historical backdrop of divorce as practiced in the patriarchy of first-century Palestine when Jesus rebuked the Pharisees for their question on whether it was permissible for a man to divorce his wife. I've heard this before, but apparently it was common practice for Jews of the day to dismiss their wives for what we would consider trifling reasons: burning the dinner 3 nights in a row, not providing adequate sexual satisfaction, or speaking 'out of turn' in a public gathering. Rev. Park asserted that understanding this exchange in its historical context makes all the difference in the world when understanding what Jesus meant when He said, "...anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, and marries another woman commits adultery" (Matthew 19:9).
In Rev. Park's opinion, this meant that Jesus was only attacking the specific wickedness of these men in disposing of their wives when they didn't please them, in order to be free to marry someone new. By contrast, he went on, Jesus' encounter with the woman at the well had a whole different tone -- one of compassion and empathy for her situation. Rightly observing that we, in our current cultural context, would tend to assume that any woman who has been through five unsuccessful marriages and is currently living with a man who is not her husband is probably a slut. This does ignore the revelation from the prior exegesis that she could very well have been a victim of the convenience divorcing practices of the men of her time. So, Rev. Park put forth the proposition that when Jesus said to her, "You are right when you say you have no husband. The fact is, you have had five husbands, and the man you now have is not your husband. What you have just said is quite true." (John 4:17,18), He was actually saying something like, "You poor thing! You've had a tough time of it at the hands of these wicked, wicked pigs of men,"
Contrasting these two 'responses' of Jesus surrounding the issue of divorce, Rev. Park went on to make what seemed to be an argument that, despite his acknowledgement of the pain and sin surrounding divorce, there were numerous scenarios where divorce was understandable, even acceptable. These scenarios included spousal abuse and something he described as 'sucking the life out of one another' where married couples had spent years staying together but failing to work out their core differences.
In other words, Rev. Park seems to have responded to an allegation of watering down the teaching of the Bible by doing just that concerning the subject of divorce. Sorry, but I just don't see the whole 'context' argument in the woman at the well encounter overriding the very clear teaching of Matthew 19. For Christians, I believe that I Corinthians 7 teaches us everything we need to know about marriage and divorce. While this is hard stuff for a lot of us (and I definitely include myself in that number), it is nonetheless what we are called to do. The time to make choices about whether to be with a particular person is prior to marriage, not after. So if a Christian woman marries a man who ends up beating her, that is not Biblical justification for divorce. That doesn't mean she has to continue to put herself and her children in harm's way. Call the police, get a PFA, press charges, insist that he get help. But don't hinder the Lord's work. Not easy stuff, I know, but the Christian life is the hard road, the narrow path.
This leads me to my own response to the overall subject of why is Church membership declining. For me, the issue boils down to a complex interaction between what's going on in society and how the church tends to respond to it.
First, the culture we live in is so highly individualistic that most folks are totally convinced of their own ability to discern truth without exercising the disciplines surrounding teaching, study, and corporate prayer, worship and fellowship.
Second, the church itself has tended to become so influenced by the surrounding culture as to fail to provide a sufficient counterweight to this type of individualistic thinking. In the focus on church growth, there seems to be a corresponding loss of emphasis on the more grinding aspects of the Christian life: meditation, study, catechism and an emphasis on service. Church has become for many little more than the Sunday morning show which is designed to tickle the ears and provide an outlet for some superficial socializing.
Finally, we as Christians MUST recognize that the message of our Lord offer hope and comfort to suffering souls, not ease and leisure. The Bible has not promised us that we wouldn't suffer consequences for both our sins and our faith. Instead, Jesus promised that "In this world you will have trouble. But take heart! I have overcome the world." John 16:33
Too many of us have taken passages like this to mean that God will make it all better. Children will obey. Spouses will be satisfying. Money troubles will disappear. Our enemies will relent.
It's just not so.
Jesus overcame the world by voluntarily subjecting Himself to enoromous suffering on behalf of people who could have cared less. Most still don't.
That is the path that true believers are also called to, although we are very fortunate in this country that we don't wrestle with the type of dire trials that afflict our brethren in places like China and the Sudan. Nonetheless, I am becoming convinced in my own life, that I am guilty of expecting, even demanding, way more from God that He's promised.
Or should I say less.
It seems that my infatuation with mega, seeker-friendly, warm and fuzzy Christianity, I have lost sight of the true source of joy and prosperity for which my soul longs: a deep and abiding relationship with Jesus Christ. I, like many of us who profess Christ, talk an awful lot about the wonders and joys of being saved, while at the same time whining and moaning about the absurdly trivial disappointments. Yes, my marriage quite frankly blows, but how does that rob me of joy? Only when I make my happiness of more importance than my obedience.
What is church membership, after all? Isn't it simply a numbers games, consistent with the corporate American mentality that bigger is better? Maximizing profits? A way of making sure that your seats are the most comfortable? Your sound system the most clear? Your musical 'worship' the most affecting and touching among all of your competition?
Isn't church growth rightly thought of as the process by which those who belong go deeper and farther with Christ through the exercise of right teaching, whole-hearted prayer, a life of service and sacrifice to each other and their community?
I belong to one of the biggest churches in my area. Over 1500 people attend two Sunday services each week. And that number is growing. But is my church growing? I wonder. I've recently been approached to take over some teaching duties for adult Sunday school, and I wonder why. My life is not marked by any evidences of spiritual maturity other than the fact that I know more of the Bible than 3/4 of the membership. Not really good enough, though, is it?
Three weeks ago, I was smoking pot and hoping my wife would leave me, so I wouldn't be the 'guilty' one. I led a 3-week discussion on Christians and the media, and people enjoyed it. People didn't challenge the content, or question the theology. They focused on the fact that I was funny, that I knew a bunch of stuff from my studies in college and the Bible over the years. I've made no secret of my shortcomings, yet I'm entertaining and willing to use the platform to fulfill my own twisted need for attention, acceptance and affirmation.
Maybe God is calling me to this. I don't really know. But what concerns me more is the fact that no one is bothering to check my credentials.
So I've come to the conclusion that the churches are often empty, even when the seats are full.
- posted by The Drake @ 10:22 AM
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Excellent post, Mr. The Drake.
A reason I see is because the west world, WWII, was "fairly" safe and we entered a golden age of prosperity. The WWII generation worked hard for it, so they appriciated it. The next generation (1960's) inherited the prosperity, but didn't have to work for it and therefor didn't appriciate it as much. God was slowly replaced throughout society with self. The destructiveness in the family and the development of the younger generations was evident, and the problem got worse, and continues to. I remember my grandmother talking about "These kids today..." and thinking she was out of touch with reality. I'm sure the kids of today think the same thing of me when I say it.
A decline in church membership is one symptom of that problem.
A reason I see is because the west world, WWII, was "fairly" safe and we entered a golden age of prosperity. The WWII generation worked hard for it, so they appriciated it. The next generation (1960's) inherited the prosperity, but didn't have to work for it and therefor didn't appriciate it as much. God was slowly replaced throughout society with self. The destructiveness in the family and the development of the younger generations was evident, and the problem got worse, and continues to. I remember my grandmother talking about "These kids today..." and thinking she was out of touch with reality. I'm sure the kids of today think the same thing of me when I say it.
A decline in church membership is one symptom of that problem.
NH,
Agreed. Prosperity has definitely contributed to the loss of an appreciation for the blessings of God in this nation. Of course, there were other cultural movements underway well before The Big One drew this country back together. Socialism/communism in this country could very easy have had a greater influence had the war not come along and helped create an environment where labor's role and economic prosperity were achieved without a class war.
Hedonism, atheism, theological liberalism and neo-orthodoxy were also hugely influential in shaping the values that firmly took hold in the '50's and '60's. The parents of the baby boomers didn't have to spoil and indulge their children, but they did in their newly found wealth.
The so-called Greatest Generation was also the first generation of permissive parents.
Not all, of course, but as a whole, I'd say that their guard was definitely down in the years after the war.
In fact, a case could be made that the biggest threat to our national security occurred in the '50's, instead of during WWII.
We raised our own worst enemies.
Agreed. Prosperity has definitely contributed to the loss of an appreciation for the blessings of God in this nation. Of course, there were other cultural movements underway well before The Big One drew this country back together. Socialism/communism in this country could very easy have had a greater influence had the war not come along and helped create an environment where labor's role and economic prosperity were achieved without a class war.
Hedonism, atheism, theological liberalism and neo-orthodoxy were also hugely influential in shaping the values that firmly took hold in the '50's and '60's. The parents of the baby boomers didn't have to spoil and indulge their children, but they did in their newly found wealth.
The so-called Greatest Generation was also the first generation of permissive parents.
Not all, of course, but as a whole, I'd say that their guard was definitely down in the years after the war.
In fact, a case could be made that the biggest threat to our national security occurred in the '50's, instead of during WWII.
We raised our own worst enemies.
I enjoyed reading this.
So, do you think adultery is a valid reason for divorce? I discussed this with someone years ago, and their take was that since marriage is a representation of Christ and His church, and because we often "cheat" on Christ, that adultery should not be a valid reason for divorce. I thought that was very interesting, but don't know how it jives with those adultery scriptures.
I'd be interested to see those church numbers broken down by denomination. I've gone to several very traditional churches (Presbyterian Church in America and Orthodox Presbyterian Church) and they're almost always full. I even helped a start up PCA that grew amazingly fast. Plus, they focus more on teaching rather than preaching/converting.
So, do you think adultery is a valid reason for divorce? I discussed this with someone years ago, and their take was that since marriage is a representation of Christ and His church, and because we often "cheat" on Christ, that adultery should not be a valid reason for divorce. I thought that was very interesting, but don't know how it jives with those adultery scriptures.
I'd be interested to see those church numbers broken down by denomination. I've gone to several very traditional churches (Presbyterian Church in America and Orthodox Presbyterian Church) and they're almost always full. I even helped a start up PCA that grew amazingly fast. Plus, they focus more on teaching rather than preaching/converting.
Kelly,
I actually tried to find some membership numbers by denomination by Googling, but to no avail. I'm sure that there are resources available, but I just don't know where at the time.
My perception of numerical decline is much the same as yours. Most of the churches that I've attended in this area are either full or growing. Obviously, the RCC is closing down parishes at an alarming rate, and it would seem that older, mainline denom churches seem to be struggling as the blue hairs who have kept the message and service mired in irrelevance slowly die off. But I should really have made more of the fact that evangelical, seeker-friendly churches are demonstrating not only an ability to attract, but also a real hunger in the culture for more than just another social outlet.
On the adultery issue, you make a good point. I don't believe that a single act of unfaithfulness is a good enough reason to terminate a marriage. I've heard some good teaching on the subject which indicates that the original text and historical context had more to do with a lifestyle of infidelity than a single or occasional instance.
This is another one of those hard places for a Christian to be in practicing obedience, forgiveness and grace. I actually have had to deal with this myself, and there is always a nagging fear in the back of my mind that things are going on that I don't know about.
What I also like about your comment is including the perspective of our own, habitual, 'cheating' on Christ. It's much harder to feel like a vicitm over the disappointments and hurts that our spouses bring into our lives when we are fully conscious of how much we have wronged God with our own conduct.
Thanks for responding.
I actually tried to find some membership numbers by denomination by Googling, but to no avail. I'm sure that there are resources available, but I just don't know where at the time.
My perception of numerical decline is much the same as yours. Most of the churches that I've attended in this area are either full or growing. Obviously, the RCC is closing down parishes at an alarming rate, and it would seem that older, mainline denom churches seem to be struggling as the blue hairs who have kept the message and service mired in irrelevance slowly die off. But I should really have made more of the fact that evangelical, seeker-friendly churches are demonstrating not only an ability to attract, but also a real hunger in the culture for more than just another social outlet.
On the adultery issue, you make a good point. I don't believe that a single act of unfaithfulness is a good enough reason to terminate a marriage. I've heard some good teaching on the subject which indicates that the original text and historical context had more to do with a lifestyle of infidelity than a single or occasional instance.
This is another one of those hard places for a Christian to be in practicing obedience, forgiveness and grace. I actually have had to deal with this myself, and there is always a nagging fear in the back of my mind that things are going on that I don't know about.
What I also like about your comment is including the perspective of our own, habitual, 'cheating' on Christ. It's much harder to feel like a vicitm over the disappointments and hurts that our spouses bring into our lives when we are fully conscious of how much we have wronged God with our own conduct.
Thanks for responding.
Exactly, NH, nothing else. And, as I said in my last post, I honestly feel that even THAT needs to be unrepentant (i.e. -- still going on) in order to justify a believer's move in taking action in divorce.
I Corinthians 7 is actually a very great guidebook regarding the whole range of marriage/divorce scenarios. It's a lot easier to really come to a conclusion from reading it that A) Christians really need to think through prayerfully any decision to marry; and B) there is almost NO justification for a believer to file for divorce, except as a way to legally reflect the spiritual reality of having been left by an unfaithful/unbelieving spouse.
Again, if your spouse is beating you and the kids, have him arrested, by all means. If they drink, do drugs or engage in any other destructive behavior, don't allow yourself to get dragged down with them. Let them bear the full consequences of their choices. I really would not want to be heard as advocating some sort of codependent attitude as spiritual.
Given these things, it makes one wonder how it is that half of the marriages in the evangelical community end up in divorce. Something is seriously wrong with that.
I've been divorced twice myself. Sadly, I was very much an adulterer during the first marriage and decided to leave after a half-hearted attempt at reconciliation. The second marriage was to the person I cheated with. I've had people tell me that it was doomed by that very fact. Perhaps.
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I Corinthians 7 is actually a very great guidebook regarding the whole range of marriage/divorce scenarios. It's a lot easier to really come to a conclusion from reading it that A) Christians really need to think through prayerfully any decision to marry; and B) there is almost NO justification for a believer to file for divorce, except as a way to legally reflect the spiritual reality of having been left by an unfaithful/unbelieving spouse.
Again, if your spouse is beating you and the kids, have him arrested, by all means. If they drink, do drugs or engage in any other destructive behavior, don't allow yourself to get dragged down with them. Let them bear the full consequences of their choices. I really would not want to be heard as advocating some sort of codependent attitude as spiritual.
Given these things, it makes one wonder how it is that half of the marriages in the evangelical community end up in divorce. Something is seriously wrong with that.
I've been divorced twice myself. Sadly, I was very much an adulterer during the first marriage and decided to leave after a half-hearted attempt at reconciliation. The second marriage was to the person I cheated with. I've had people tell me that it was doomed by that very fact. Perhaps.
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